Vista Primary, XP added!

[Darrell Lawrence]

This is cool. Spent a day and a half fighting with it (error on my part), but my Vista machine now has XP as a second OS on it!

So all them programs not ready for Vista, I can now run on the XP OS ;)

[gmd3d]

vista .. I have been sitting on the fence with that since it was released ..

[Darrell Lawrence]

If your machine has XP already on it, stay with it until Vista catches up in the 3rd party programs area.

[gmd3d]

when oh when will that be :)

[Darrell Lawrence]

Probably never :D

[evil_genius_180]

If you installed XP on the PC, why even keep Vista at all? (besides being able to play Halo 2 for the PC. ;))

I've got a question for all you Vista users. I'm in the market for a new PC but don't have the money to replace my monitor, which isn't as old as my computer anyway. I've seen new monitors that are "Vista certified." Here's my question: Will my monitor (which is a few years old) work with Vista or should I just buy components build another XP machine? (which is another way I'm leaning.) 'Cause, if I can't get my monitor to work with Vista, what's the use of having a new PC?

[Darrell Lawrence]

Vista came with the machine.

Ain't gonna delete it, for when that rainy day hits...

[evil_genius_180]

Ah, that makes sense. Plus some Microsoft games (Like Halo 2) require Vista to run, but that's just a crappy marketing ploy on Microsoft's part.

[Fretslayer]

I resista the vista!

When the day comes that I have to ditch my XP in favor of a new OS I'll probably try to find a way to get my animation software (and recording studio software) to run on Linux.

I have a few friends with Vista machines and they have such a difficult time with their software and hardware...In that regard Vista reminds me of DOS 5 with a GUI. LOL!

[Darrell Lawrence]

I have a few friends with Vista machines and they have such a difficult time with their software and hardware...Hence adding XP to a machine that came with Vista ;)

[Fretslayer]

I'll tell ya, Warrior - I have a bit of a background in tech support and assembling computers and I've seen a lot of businesses around both where I'm currently located as well as back home in Florida that make a killing by uninstalling Vista and installing XP.

I dread the day I have to move to another OS...Hell, the only reason I 'upgraded' from DOS 6.2.2 to Windows 95 was because 'Diablo' wouldn't run in DOS. LOL!

I think your creating a dual bootable machine is a pretty smart move.

[XRaiderV1]

dual boot is also the way I'm gonna go with the new computer I'm buying in a few weeks time.

it's a systemax pc, and the model in question comes with a free anytime vista business upgrade, I hope I can make it a dual boot.

[Darrell Lawrence]

When you're ready to give it a shot, lemme know and I'll show you how to do it with hopefully no problems :)

[evil_genius_180]

I've got a question. When you start your computer with both OSes installed, does it automatically give you the option of selecting your OS of choice on start up or do you have to get one of the those programs that lets you chose which drive/partition you want to load?

The reason I'm asking is, I'm getting closer to having enough money saved to buy my new PC and I'm gonna give Vista a shot. However, if it gets to be too much of a pain in the butt, I don't want to lose the newer OS altogether, so I'm probably gonna do what you did and install XP on a separate drive using my install CD. I hear it's easy to find XP drivers online for many of the new PCs out there. :)

I've read some user reviews where people totally nix Vista when they buy a new PC instead of saving it and that sounds stupid, especially since they're supposed to be "finalizing" (fixing) it soon so they can concentrate on working on Windows 7, which I hear is coming out in 2010.

[Darrell Lawrence]

When all is said and done, this is what happens: Your PC logo/intro comes up. Then instead of starting the OS at the "log in" (if you have a password), two OS choices show instead... the Primary and the secondary. You can choose whichever you want to load.

[evil_genius_180]

Nice. I definitely need to figure out how to do that when I get my new PC. At least I know where to go for advice. :)

[XRaiderV1]

warrior, soon as it gets here, and I make the recovery media, I'll shoot you a line for that walk through.

should be around the 5th of july, that I actually order it.

[Darrell Lawrence]

Before you make that recovery media, contact me.

[XRaiderV1]

I'm gonna make two sets of recovery media, one with XP only, the other, with the system set up as a dual boot, effectively covering my six.

yes, I will contact you before I even make the XP only set.

[Darrell Lawrence]

What I'm gonna tell you about is the making of a VISTA recovery disk. Most PC's have Vista recovery on a partition on the computer, not recovery CD's/DVD's.

[XRaiderV1]

the computer in question has XP Pro as it's factory installed OS, and has an anytime vista upgrade included.

if you want, I'll link you to the computer in question.

[evil_genius_180]

What I'm gonna tell you about is the making of a VISTA recovery disk. Most PC's have Vista recovery on a partition on the computer, not recovery CD's/DVD's.

That's the standard with new PCs these days. It has been for the past few years. Since most of them come with some kind of burner, they hardly ever come with recovery media anymore. You can either burn your own (some new PCs even include disks on which you can burn said recovery media) or order one from the company for a fee (usually about $20.)

[XRaiderV1]

between you, me, warrior, and the refrigerator magnets, I prefer actual disc media to relying on hard drive based recovery partitions.

you loose the hard drive, you're basically SOL, particularly if you're out of discs and cant update your recovery discs.....

[evil_genius_180]

Yes, that's completely true. It's always a good idea to make your recovery media or order the CD/DVD from the company. You can reformat if your windows install has a problem but, as you say, if your HD goes to crap and you have to replace it, you're SOL without those recovery discs.

[Darrell Lawrence]

Exactly. Which is why I said I'd show how to make the recovery disk :)

[XRaiderV1]

well, this should be interesting.

I'm looking forward to setting the machine up.

[Darrell Lawrence]

When you get the machine, will you be receiving the recovery/install disks for XP?

[XRaiderV1]

dear gods, I hope so.
even if I dont, there's nothing stopping me from borrowing my friend's multisystem licensed copy of XP Pro and going that route.

it's a systemax pc, so, I dont really know if I'll be getting a recovery/install disc, though, I expect they'll give me a dvd for the vista business upgrade the system's coming with.

here's the link:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3042914&CatId=1307
see the below wordpad file for a list of specifications, note how the specs and indeed the whole tower changed as I ironed out exactly what I need.

changed listed with earliest at the top, and most current at the bottom.

I've also listed purely for my own convenience, the pricing info, including shipping, though, others, should they be so inclined, may well benefit from this info.

I've got a technical question, since it's a 64 bit system, you think there's any chance they'll load the x64 bit version of XP Pro?

[Darrell Lawrence]

Why's the price higher than what's listed on the page?

And I see No Software bundle selected.

BTW, from that link: http://static.tigerdirect.com/html/advisory_RECOVERY_MEDIA.html

[evil_genius_180]

It says at the bottom of the page that it doesn't come with recovery media, dude. It doesn't really say it, but you can always tell the systems that Tiger Direct sells that don't have included recovery media because they have that warning on the product page. Though, since it's Systemax, if you got to select your OS, it might not even be installed. I've been looking at their systems and, for some of the ones where you get to chose your OS, they kinda just pack the CD in the box and let you install it yourself. (could be a good thing.)

[XRaiderV1]

I downgraded the warranty, and chose specific parts.

if you select the options I have, the math should add up.

not bad for a decent starting game system, not great either, but just exactly what I need, nothing more, or less.

[Darrell Lawrence]

The PC I bought a year ago, around $500.

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/product?product=3436821&lc=en&cc=us&dlc=en&lang=en&cc=us

Before you commit to that PC, I recommend at least looking here for a better deal:

http://www.shopping.hp.com/webapp/shopping/store_access.do?template_type=landing&landing=desktops&jumpid=re_R602_prodexp/hpcom/psg/desktops/

[XRaiderV1]

uh, can you link to the product page for the machine?
the page that lets me click add to cart?

also, I did a BBB search on both tiger direct, and systemax, and both have excellent ratings, which is what led me to them in the first place, before I even began to iron out the specs for what I need the machine to be capable of.

[Darrell Lawrence]

If you mean the first link to add to cart, it's not available anymore. The second link is what's available :)

[evil_genius_180]

@ XRaiderV1, just click on the product information link. Then, on the next page, click on product specifications and you'll get all the info. :D

@ Warrior, that's a nice looking system. I like Compaq PCs, in fact they're all I've ever bought. My next one might not be a Compaq (though I am looking at a couple of their recertified systems) but they make a nice product. :D

[XRaiderV1]

found a laptop that's caught my eye, take a look at the configuration options, with a few tweaks I think it'll be a borderline decent gaming system, and be good for occasional mesh renders.

HP LAPTOP (http://www.shopping.hp.com/series/category/notebooks/dv6700z_series/3/computer_store?jumpid=in_r329_personalization/browse1/home_SDP)

it comes with vista, but, I think the capabilities of the system hardware, not to mention the fact it's $10-20 dollars cheaper than the systemax, have pretty much thrown my plan into limbo, I need to figure out which is the better deal.

now, I'm not looking to run anything better than halo 1 or 2(optimistic assessment, at least), so, I can live with the options they give me when configuring the system.

also, my stepsister has GOT to be the ONLY person I know who's never had not even ONE problem with vista, and she's a complete illiterate when it comes to computers, so, go figure the odds on that one, I guarantee you wont like the answer, lol.

[evil_genius_180]

Well, the original Halo is several years old (even for the PC version) so it only requires about a 900 MHz processor and probably only about 256 MB of RAM or so and a decent video and sound card (but nothing too new.) Halo 2 would require more PC and I know from looking at the system requirements that you have to have Vista to run it. (one requirement I'm not to thrilled about but the games are released through Microsoft, so it's not that shocking.) You'd have to compare the Halo 2 system requirements with what you can get on the system and see if it can match the requirements. However, if you just want the original Halo (better game, IMO) you could get by with cheapest options I see on that page, I'd imagine.

But that's just for the Halo games. There are other games to consider and if that's gonna be your primary function and you want newer games, you might want to spend some more money (if you have it.) Also, your renders will go more quickly if you spend the extra money.

But, all in all, that HP laptop looks good (for a reasonable laptop.) I'm personally not a fan of laptops because I like to get "basic" systems and then upgrade them, which is more expensive in the long run but I have to think of my short-term budget. And it's just harder to upgrade a laptop.

[XRaiderV1]

while this post has nothing to do with the topic, aside from the fact that it involves computers:

actually, I do alot of pixel art, and a few months ago rediscovered an old favorite program I used to have back in the win98 days, called bryce, I intend to do some casual renders, and, while speed is important gaming wise, when it comes to rendering, I could care less how long it takes(within reason of course).

I did up a render a while back of the starship prometheus, I have the file on memory card, my first half decent render, and it came out looking great, without trying, and, with little more than a reflective ground plane, the ship at a skewed angle(it imported that way for some dumb reason), and that's all she wrote.

oh, I quoted sam jackson from diehard with a vengance, so, if there's any concern about content, say it now, or forever hold your peace.

for the record, I did this image on my current system, an obsolete dell optiplex, with a pentium 3 500mhz processor, 256mb of ram, a dinky 4gb hard drive, and entirely too little patience, I damn near kicked the monitor over towards the end.

the images have the date of rendering on them, they are linked as thumbnail views via imageshack.

http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/1015/prometheusgettheoutofmypj8.th.png (http://img79.imageshack.us/my.php?image=prometheusgettheoutofmypj8.png) http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/7445/prometheuszeusdj3.th.png (http://img79.imageshack.us/my.php?image=prometheuszeusdj3.png)
click the thumbnails to go to the image, click again for full size.

[XRaiderV1]

oh, and the laptop meets the min. specs, but, again, I mainly do pixel art, my fanfics and some casual 3d rendering, and surfing the net, so, it really doesnt matter as long as it gets me where I wanna go.

[evil_genius_180]

As far as Sam Jackson quotes go, that one is pretty tame. BTW, the name of the character he played in the movie is Zeus, like it says in the quote. (love that movie :D)

The renders aren't bad, they could use some textures. Which version of Bryce are you using?

[Darrell Lawrence]

For that matter, which version of the ship is that, Ed's tS version, or the LW conversion?

[XRaiderV1]

5.5, the free edition, available on download.com

the lightwave mesh conversion, available here:

http://www.trekmeshes.ch/meshes/meshesdetails.php?Name=PROMENTHEUS

I plan on loading this one on the new hardware soon as it gets here:
http://www.foundation3d.com/index.php?categoryid=38&p13_sectionid=307&p13_fileid=351

I was able to load the ed giddings mesh rather easily into bryce, but, alot of the other lightwave meshes were of a newer file version, and thus, incompatible with bryce directly, but I was able to load most into blender and do a simple export as a .obj, with the required .mtl file.

[Darrell Lawrence]

Oh. Ed's v2 version. I had converted his v1 version to LW is why I asked :)

I forgot he did v2 in LW (actually, Inspire is what he used) from the get go.

Isn't that second link the same model as the first link?

[XRaiderV1]

I've always had a thing for the prometheus, and, inspire, as in a computer brand/model?

speaking of prometheus, I really should find some decent shots of her letting loose with the full weight of her awesome firepower, screen caps just dont do the ship justice, and, I already know I lack the patience to pull off such a feat myself.

ah well, never hurts to hope.

[Darrell Lawrence]

Inspire was the junior version of LW 5.6.

[XRaiderV1]

thank you warrior, I actually bought a laptop, that im much happier with than I would have been with the desktop, I owe you a big one.

thank you!

[Darrell Lawrence]

So did they send back up disks for Vista, or is the back up on a partition?

[XRaiderV1]

you have the option to purchase system recovery dvds when you order your system, and yes, i bought system recovery dvds, and yes it has a back-up partition as well.

3gb of system ram, 256mb nvidea geforce 3d card, 2.0 ghz intel pentium core 2 duo processor, 32 bit vista home premium.

runs like a champ, particularly once I terminated the UAC, and disabled the aero theme.

runs halo like it was born to do so.

so, in short, I'm happy.

[Darrell Lawrence]

Well good. If you have the disks already, then no need to walk you through making a GOOD back-up in regards to the partition :)

[XRaiderV1]

i fail to see the purpose behind a puny 2gb recovery partition.....

[Darrell Lawrence]

2GB? Hell... mine is closer to 9GB. Probably because you got the disks too.

[XRaiderV1]

hey, warrior, just wanted to pop in and say thank you for pointing me to HP, I cant even begin to say how much happier I am with the laptop than I would have been with the desktop.

I owe you big time.

[Darrell Lawrence]

You're welcome, and Happy Thanksgiving!

[XRaiderV1]

happy turkey day to you as well.

this is off topic:
hey, you know the stargate in the quick reply box, you got a bigger version, on, say, a black background?

been looking for a suitable one for use as a wallpaper for ages, and I never can seem to get any of the gate meshes to co-operate.

[johnart]

I'm running Windows XP SP3, Im not gonna shift to Vista when Windows 7 is so near.

[evil_genius_180]

That makes sense. XP is still a very solid OS and Microsoft has extended their support for it for another 6 years. Unfortunately, though, some of us had to buy new PCs because our crap was from the Flintstones, so we got stuck with Vista. Having said that, though, it's not all that bad.

[XRaiderV1]

it's alot more stable than when it first came out, that's for sure.